Camera Zoom/Camera control.

[Tchernobog]

Description:
Many RTS games have been influenced by other past games. Most of these will have been influenced by earlier C&C games, but more often by not, by the 800 pound gorilla: Starcraft. I say, ignore (well not ignore, but move away slightly) from starcraft, and take deeper looks at what many consider the finest RTSes (those of us with more refined tastes ;)) : Total Annihilation and Supreme Commander.

Many mechanics and game concepts were brilliant in there but never made it into other RTSes because "Starcraft didn't do it", which is a massive shame. In this case, the idea of note is the camera control. Most games, yes, even Starcraft 2, can let you zoom in for a closer look on your units. That is becoming an industry standard. But Supreme Commander innovated more with the extreme control of the zoom. The mouse wheel (or other button that you preferred to assign) let you zoom out... and out... and out some more, until you had a fullscreen version of what is essentially your minimap, but still with complete control of the battlefield.

More RTSes, and the next C&C, should have this tool.

Positive effect:
More control of the camera/zoom, which is a sadly lacking function in many RTS today. It also allows for greater map control. Imagine this: you're focusing on your base, decide to go attack the front lines. Use the mouse wheel to scroll down, get transported to satellite view. Move your mouse slightly to the desired position, scroll up, bam, you're at the right place :)

Negative effect:
I imagine this is a fairly resource consuming function to implement, having all those levels of zoom in a game. But it is worth it, as it is one of the best tools ever made in an RTS.

Media:
http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSdw-4W_MO93wYx2aHPwRV7m8QYbp_kL42mADZ-7ScM3-i9-rA_

Zoomed in.

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRKMRD1iGN5yneQCInuSJdnUNELq-eiFRGhx_ZQRQIi9tJ67zUOQA

Zoomed out.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4ZJzOEOLnE

Video of the function in action. Although this guy could have zoomed out somewhat smoother :D

[Zocom7]

This is one true concept but resolution comes first, then this.

[Moongrave]

Agree except I'll hate to play a game just looking at coloured dots on a 2D map

Guess they need to put a limit on the zoom but not so restrictive

[methuselah]

Welcome to C&C.com Tchernobog. This made me chuckle


.........and take deeper looks at what many consider the finest RTSes (those of us with more refined tastes ;)) : Total Annihilation and Supreme Commander.


not arguing your point mind you I've never experienced either game I just enjoyed your presentation. As to your overall premise I for one would love to see much more camera control in the next C&C but I could not care any less for the global or atmospheric look.

That is just my preference though I'm interested in seeing what everyone else thinks because this has been an issue C&C wise for some time.

[stephanovich]

I would like to be able to zoom out a bit more than currently, but that much is just unnecessary IMO. C&C has never been about battles in a scale that would actually make that useful in any way and the maps (even the ones in TS) are not big enough for it either really. So I don't see the point in being able to zoom out that much. A little more would be welcome as you are really close in TT and RA3 IMO.

[Lauren]

Maybe a second monitor could be like a radar, that would be nice, but I wouldn't like it having less micro cause you have to zoom out.

[Mr_Armageddon]

I was really disappointed with the camera controls on C&C 4. The limitation on how far you could zoom out was a real pain. There were times I had a hard time selecting all of my units because I couldn't see them all at the same time due to how close the camera was to the ground.

The zoom feature on Sup Com is amazing, and for those that don't want to play zoomed out all the way (mini map style), you don't have to. You can keep the zoom at the level you choose. But the ability to do so should still be an option of players that want more of a tactical view of the entire battlefield. Give the player the option to play how they want regarding camera zoom, don't limit the ability.

Sup Com also allows you to use a secondary monitor as a dedicated large mini-map of the battlefield. A lot more gamers now use dual or triple displays. C&C 5 should incorporate those types of features in order to stay competitive with other RTS titles.

[Tchernobog]

Maybe a second monitor could be like a radar, that would be nice, but I wouldn't like it having less micro cause you have to zoom out.

As Armageddon said, that was indeed a function in Supreme Commander. For that matter, you could use the second monitor and zoom in as much as you wanted and control it from that screen too.

Multi-screen usage would be awesome, yes.

[CnC_Fin]

I'd really like to see more possibilities with cameras, and perhaps skybox for all maps, so you can take cool screenshots while the camera is horizontal

[Dryopes]

As Armageddon said, that was indeed a function in Supreme Commander. For that matter, you could use the second monitor and zoom in as much as you wanted and control it from that screen too.

Multi-screen usage would be awesome, yes.

except if that would be allowed in the multiplayer, C&C5 will never get a e-sport scene :/

[TiberianFiend]

I'm not really for this idea, I must admit although I liked Supreme commander - the camera system was unique to that game specifically, I felt the Supreme com camera system felt abit cheap considering; as having too many camera options can also ruin a game's intended perpective - its understandable in supreme commander because of the scale you work at; but C&C have the nice old battles that take place on battlefields in specific parts of the world and hardly warrant an excessive scale zoom system.

Should EA increase the scaling of the map to have more Tiberian Sun scaled maps then i'd suggested a greater camera zoom rate but only by abit; after all you can change the extremes of the camera zoom through the World Builder - the game's zoom really gave C&C the perpective the designers were looking to achieve.

I'd say keep the old camera system - perhaps add pitch change for screenies, but a 2D map for the sake of a large battlefield is a huge nono in my books, though i'd have to say a skybox and the removal of the graphic cut off point would be nice.

[Strike120]

The camera needs to be at the distance it was at in the pre-generals games. Way into the sky

[Golan2781]

Pre-Generals, there wasn't a fixed camera distance, it was tied to screen resolution. C&C1 with the original resolution showed a lot less than TW or RA3.

[Technique]

If the game is good and fast paced aka not supreme commander and not sc2... but more like RA2... you have no time to play around with some camera...

If you do have the time to play around with the camera it's a slowpaced game and then you are better off playing sc2.

[Zaptagious]

All I want would be possinility to zoom out much more, an overhead topdown view is not necessary.